Comments on: Via Bike: Turning and intersection safety http://blog.cascade.org/2012/05/turn-with-care/ Creating a better community through bicycling, throughout Seattle, King County and Washington state. Mon, 20 May 2013 20:54:18 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.2 By: Mike Sharp http://blog.cascade.org/2012/05/turn-with-care/comment-page-1/#comment-52949 Mike Sharp Wed, 30 May 2012 20:03:28 +0000 http://blog.cascade.org/?p=13124#comment-52949 On my daily commute from Seattle to Kent, this intersection is a challenge, when travelling east from left to right, staying on 256th: http://maps.google.com/maps?hl=en&ll=47.372355,-122.201639&spn=0.001564,0.002663&hnear=Seattle,+King,+Washington&t=h&z=19 There's no legal way across the intersection to continue down 256th (the Y on the right side of the map) so option B and C are not possible. Several years ago, I dismounted at 104th and 256th, crossed the crosswalk, and proceeded east on the wrong side of the road toward the crosswalk. I was hit by a car coming out of the parking lot to my left. Of course, even though I was walking my bike, any pedestrian would have been hit under those circumstances--the driver was looking for traffic coming from two directions to his left, and not looking ahead or to the right. The problem is that there are cars coming at high speed from many different directions, and othe cars entering and leaving the roadway. It's not safe or practical to use option A, since the traffic on the road is travelling at high speed, and while legal, it's just not safe--no one wants to wait for a bike, and I've had a couple very close calls from angry drivers who think they'll send a message by passing closely at high speed, honking their horn. So what I do is proceed east on 256th through the intersection at 104th, and pull to the right curb. There is a lot of extra room there. I wait for the green light to turn yellow, and the last car to finish passing through the intersection, then I continue east, crossing (and signalling) both lanes of traffic into the "left turn" lane (which actually goes straight as 256th). There are a few moments between the time the traffic stops going east, and when the traffic heading South in the two left turn lanes on 104th gets going. This is the only safe route up the East Hill in Kent, and I think it sucks that the designers didn't consider bicycles in this intersection. Regards, Mike On my daily commute from Seattle to Kent, this intersection is a challenge, when travelling east from left to right, staying on 256th:

http://maps.google.com/maps?hl=en&ll=47.372355,-122.201639&spn=0.001564,0.002663&hnear=Seattle,+King,+Washington&t=h&z=19

There’s no legal way across the intersection to continue down 256th (the Y on the right side of the map) so option B and C are not possible. Several years ago, I dismounted at 104th and 256th, crossed the crosswalk, and proceeded east on the wrong side of the road toward the crosswalk. I was hit by a car coming out of the parking lot to my left. Of course, even though I was walking my bike, any pedestrian would have been hit under those circumstances–the driver was looking for traffic coming from two directions to his left, and not looking ahead or to the right.

The problem is that there are cars coming at high speed from many different directions, and othe cars entering and leaving the roadway. It’s not safe or practical to use option A, since the traffic on the road is travelling at high speed, and while legal, it’s just not safe–no one wants to wait for a bike, and I’ve had a couple very close calls from angry drivers who think they’ll send a message by passing closely at high speed, honking their horn.

So what I do is proceed east on 256th through the intersection at 104th, and pull to the right curb. There is a lot of extra room there. I wait for the green light to turn yellow, and the last car to finish passing through the intersection, then I continue east, crossing (and signalling) both lanes of traffic into the “left turn” lane (which actually goes straight as 256th). There are a few moments between the time the traffic stops going east, and when the traffic heading South in the two left turn lanes on 104th gets going.

This is the only safe route up the East Hill in Kent, and I think it sucks that the designers didn’t consider bicycles in this intersection.

Regards,
Mike

]]> By: Bike News Roundup: In the future, everyone will visit the Space Needle in their Oldsmobile | Seattle Bike Blog http://blog.cascade.org/2012/05/turn-with-care/comment-page-1/#comment-52842 Bike News Roundup: In the future, everyone will visit the Space Needle in their Oldsmobile | Seattle Bike Blog Tue, 29 May 2012 16:52:35 +0000 http://blog.cascade.org/?p=13124#comment-52842 [...] Via Bike: Turning and intersection safety « Cascade Bicycle Club Blog – Illustrations of three acceptable ways to make a left turn. [...] [...] Via Bike: Turning and intersection safety « Cascade Bicycle Club Blog – Illustrations of three acceptable ways to make a left turn. [...]

]]> By: Rick http://blog.cascade.org/2012/05/turn-with-care/comment-page-1/#comment-52420 Rick Thu, 24 May 2012 18:12:59 +0000 http://blog.cascade.org/?p=13124#comment-52420 I forgot Option D, which I have used with signaled crosswalks on multi-laned roads with lots of traffic. From the right lane or bike lane, leave the roadway onto the sidewalk at the nearest corner and dismount. When the signaled crossing permits, cross the road that you just exited. Once across, wait for a signal to cross to the right side of your destination road. Once completely across, look for an opportunity to re-enter the roadway and move with traffic. Usually, I try to move away from the corner, further down the block before putting my bike in the roadway again. It separates me from the pedestrians at the corner crosswalk, and puts some space between me and traffic turning right onto the roadway behind me. That turning traffic is likely to be busy with looking for pedestrians in two crosswalks and/or traffic from the left. Expecting them to notice a bicycle just getting underway right in front of them after the turn is perhaps expecting a little too much. It's not always about getting there faster. It is ALWAYS about getting there safely. I forgot Option D, which I have used with signaled crosswalks on multi-laned roads with lots of traffic. From the right lane or bike lane, leave the roadway onto the sidewalk at the nearest corner and dismount. When the signaled crossing permits, cross the road that you just exited. Once across, wait for a signal to cross to the right side of your destination road. Once completely across, look for an opportunity to re-enter the roadway and move with traffic. Usually, I try to move away from the corner, further down the block before putting my bike in the roadway again. It separates me from the pedestrians at the corner crosswalk, and puts some space between me and traffic turning right onto the roadway behind me. That turning traffic is likely to be busy with looking for pedestrians in two crosswalks and/or traffic from the left. Expecting them to notice a bicycle just getting underway right in front of them after the turn is perhaps expecting a little too much.

It’s not always about getting there faster. It is ALWAYS about getting there safely.

]]> By: Rick http://blog.cascade.org/2012/05/turn-with-care/comment-page-1/#comment-52417 Rick Thu, 24 May 2012 17:49:16 +0000 http://blog.cascade.org/?p=13124#comment-52417 Option C, done as recommended in the original post, is safe. If you cannot stop and dismount safely from your bike, you need more practice. If you just WON'T dismount from your bike to make a crossing, you need counseling. Even in situations where it makes sense to stay on my bike in a transition from 'road vehicle' to 'sidewalk vehicle,' I make sure that that transition is clear to motorists. None of the options described above are safe if done carelessly or improperly. The careless maneuver that Ken describes is every bit as dumb and dangerous as turning left from the right-hand bike lane. Option C, done as recommended in the original post, is safe. If you cannot stop and dismount safely from your bike, you need more practice. If you just WON’T dismount from your bike to make a crossing, you need counseling. Even in situations where it makes sense to stay on my bike in a transition from ‘road vehicle’ to ‘sidewalk vehicle,’ I make sure that that transition is clear to motorists. None of the options described above are safe if done carelessly or improperly. The careless maneuver that Ken describes is every bit as dumb and dangerous as turning left from the right-hand bike lane.

]]> By: Ken Gross http://blog.cascade.org/2012/05/turn-with-care/comment-page-1/#comment-52413 Ken Gross Thu, 24 May 2012 16:43:04 +0000 http://blog.cascade.org/?p=13124#comment-52413 Regarding the proper (legal) way for bikes to make left hand turns, it seems that option A is the only safe option. Options B and C are complex and require stopping, dismounting and manuevering. I've witnessed often Option C where the rider does NOT stop and dismount but immediately proceeds across the cross walk in one motion- VERY DANGEROUS. Have almost hit bikes with my car when this action is taken. If you are driving a car, you woudl have no lcue where th ebike is going. Please do not recommend option C! Thanks. Regarding the proper (legal) way for bikes to make left hand turns, it seems that option A is the only safe option. Options B and C are complex and require stopping, dismounting and manuevering. I’ve witnessed often Option C where the rider does NOT stop and dismount but immediately proceeds across the cross walk in one motion- VERY DANGEROUS. Have almost hit bikes with my car when this action is taken. If you are driving a car, you woudl have no lcue where th ebike is going. Please do not recommend option C! Thanks.

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